# 665. Werner Herzog Isn’t Afraid ...  ## Episode metadata - Episode title: 665. Werner Herzog Isn’t Afraid ... - Show: Freakonomics Radio - Owner / Host: Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher - Guests: [Werner Herzog](https://share.snipd.com/person/c7da792c-5edf-403e-b948-ff1b93361059) - Episode publish date: 2026-02-27 - Episode AI description: Werner Herzog, German-born filmmaker and writer known for over 70 daring films and books, offers wide-ranging reflections. He defends ‘ecstatic truth’ in art. He recounts survival, filmmaking obsessions like Fitzcarraldo, meeting Hiro Onoda, and why some works take decades to be seen. He warns about sloppy thinking, disinformation, and the risks of AI while celebrating resilience and creative stubbornness. - Mentioned books: [The Future of Trust](https://share.snipd.com/book/ef0531de-8496-4de9-b125-2cfa8dd7229f) by [Roz Taylor](https://share.snipd.com/person/2832d3f9-1881-4381-9d7f-3b06f498cfee), [Every Man for Himself and God Against All](https://share.snipd.com/book/462da2e0-b604-4f77-8520-9c6ce18a2f2a) by [Werner Herzog](https://share.snipd.com/person/c7da792c-5edf-403e-b948-ff1b93361059) - Duration: 49:08 - Episode URL: [Open in Snipd](https://share.snipd.com/episode/7db02f5d-c109-4992-bbbc-b130fa7b0504) - Show URL: [Open in Snipd](https://share.snipd.com/show/77af7fd9-dd24-4eb7-baf2-0910959d19bb) - Export date: 2026-05-08T10:38:03 ## Snips ### [Germany Turned Remembrance Into Law And Education](https://share.snipd.com/snip/0365f3aa-4586-461e-a099-20d4fb1de87a) 🎧 19:57 - 21:03 (01:06) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/f6284913-7bdb-48d3-a85f-821a213384e4" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Herzog says postwar Germany consistently built remembrance into schools and laws, including criminalizing Holocaust denial. - He argues this cultural choice shapes public life and informs why political outcomes (like Trump's rise) reflect broad worldviews, not luck. #### 💬 Quote > For example, it is a criminal offense to be a denier of Holocaust. > — Werner Herzog Werner Herzog on Germany's postwar approach to memory #### 📚 Transcript **Werner Herzog:** And it's not only education, it's translated into legislation. For example, it is a criminal offense to be a denier of Holocaust. If you're a fervent denier and go to public as a denier of the Holocaust, you will end up in jail in Germany. And I think it's good that it is like this. I've heard you **Stephen J. Dubner:** speak about living in a culture of complaint. My wife has a phrase for certain kinds of people. She calls them injustice collectors. That's a good characterization, yeah. I'd love you to say whatever more you can about what you mean by a culture of complaint, and especially what you think is the cost of that. I mean it in a larger **Werner Herzog:** context, of course. I mean what you're hinting at politically. And I try to encourage all my friends who are not Trump supporters. I tell them, don't complain. It is the majority. It's not lottery that brought Trump to the presidency. He won the popular vote by a very --- ### [Make Your Students Strong Rather Than Happy](https://share.snipd.com/snip/7288dc54-ba45-46f0-b91c-87ade82250b8) 🎧 23:33 - 24:55 (01:22) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/8d5c7c6a-5cc3-4d6f-8454-0374a140c967" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Herzog criticizes an education that praises mediocrity and avoids honest critique, producing a culture of complaint. - He advises forcing tough practice: demand rewrites, push students to improve, and prepare them for a harsh world. #### 💬 Quote > And the philosophies make the children happy instead of making them strong. > — Werner Herzog Werner Herzog on education #### 📚 Transcript **Werner Herzog:** Today, you can make a documentary that is cinema quality for under $10,000, a one-and film. Work as an Uber driver, work in a lunatic asylum, work as a bouncer in a sex club. That's what I always **Stephen J. Dubner:** recommend. Or as a German rodeo clown like you did, yes? In **Werner Herzog:** Mexico, yeah, yeah. Well, I earned money because I had to survive. You **Stephen J. Dubner:** earned money in a lot of interesting ways, yeah. Yes, **Werner Herzog:** but I made my money really old-fashioned way. I really earned it. Where do you think that culture of complaint, where do you think that comes from? It probably has wide sources, broad sources. In the West, I see an educational system that immediately rewards you for everything. Ah, great job. And it can be a lousy sketch, lousier than anyone in class. And you have to be praised for it. There's no way to tell a kid, well, this wasn't really good work, but I know you can do better. And why don't you work on this? it to me tomorrow. All of a sudden, you have a good one. It's a philosophy behind education. And the philosophies make the children happy instead of making them strong. Just for God's sake, make them strong guys, strong young women. --- Created with [Snipd](https://www.snipd.com) | Highlight & Take Notes from Podcasts